Native Stories (00:02):

Welcome to our first interview in collaboration with Indigenous Mathematician, Indigenous Mathematicians was created to bring all Indigenous Mathematicians together for the purpose representation in the field of mathematics for the future generations. Craig young is from Rough Rock, Arizona and was nominated recently for their presidential awards for excellence in mathematics and science teaching. The nation’s highest honor for STEM and computer science teachers. Welcome Craig. If you could tell us a little bit about where you’re born and your genealogy,

Craig Young (00:41):

Uh, young, when I got so translation, I was, uh, speaking in Navajo introducing myself. So my name is Craig young. I’m de uh, I hail from the great Navajo nation from, uh, rough rock Arizona. Uh, currently I reside in tuba city, Arizona on the Western side of the Navajo nation. Uh, just a little background in Navajo nation is roughly the size of West Virginia. Um, and we have about about 400,000 members in a, in the, in a tribe in, uh, the Navajo nation is about roughly 27,673 square miles. Uh, it covers, uh, states, uh, with, uh, New Mexico, Arizona, Utah, and, and borders, Colorado. Um, so that’s where we’re, I’m from. Um, so a little bit about my background. Um, so I, I, uh, I’m a, I’m a mathematician, uh, right now I’m teaching, uh, in, in the elementary setting. I’ve, I’ve taught in high school and, uh, also in, in college, uh, for adult learners and, uh, this is who I am and then, you know, welcome and thank you guys for having me here and, you know, let going to get started. <laugh>

Native Stories (02:05):

Yeah, I’m gonna add a little bit more. So he is a stem educator at no mathematician after school program staffer at tuba city boarding school. Um, he maintains a family is working on doctorate in leadership at fielding graduate university. He also run TCBs Thunderbird robotics team is part of the Alliance of indigenous math circles runs tuba city’s Arrowhead math circles runs a few more camps across the nation, um, and runs warrior of hope in character development for boys who get in, um, who need a little bit more help at school. Uh, so that is a lot, uh, I, I have some background in math cuz uh, my electrical engineering, uh, degree, but I forget everything. So I’m like, okay, algebra is the far further this I could go in this conversation. So welcome Craig, uh, to NA stories. And we’re gonna jump into the questions right now. Okay. Um, so who are your ancestors that you are grateful for or wanna talk about?

Craig Young (03:16):

Well, um, I wanna start off with my, my, uh, maternal grandparents. Uh, uh, we, I would call my maternal grandmother, uh, Shamus, which is, uh, my, my maternal grandma. Uh, her name was Ida. She Harvey. Uh, she was from rough rock Arizona. Um, she was the matriarch of, uh, our family. So we’re we, we come from or the Navajo culture, uh, you know, we are the females, they’re the leaders in our family and um, our art clans, my first clans Kane, uh, one who walks around clan and uh, you know, that’s, that’s who I am. That was my grandma’s clan. That’s my, my, my mother’s clan as well. Um, and then also my cha my maternal grandfather, his name was, uh, Carl C. Harvey. He was a, a council delegate here on the Navajo nation, uh, for, for rock point Arizona around that region, uh, for a number of years back in this seventies and, and eighties.

Craig Young (04:18):

And, uh, that’s where the leadership, uh, comes from from my family. Um, on my father’s side, uh, you know, I have, uh, Julius, uh, young who, who was also well he’s, he was also, uh, a person that I looked up to a lot. And, uh, you know, I just wanted to say, thank you for him, uh, for everybody, uh, who, who has been there, but also going back further, um, you know, we, we mentioned ancestors and I wanna acknowledge the, the indigenous, um, our indigenous warriors way back when, uh, who were a part of their resistance to, to maintain, uh, culture and maintain language and, uh, you know, fight for, for, for identity, um, and our way of life. And, uh, you know, I, I know that, um, uh, I guess, uh, colonization, um, really hit a lot of indigenous communities. We very hard throughout history. And, you know, when we, when we look at mathematics in, in a way it’s, it’s, it’s other, uh, it’s westernized concept that, that type of thinking that a big disconnect. And so my, my, uh, my job here, uhhu mathematics, um, and reconnect that with, uh, our Navajo culture, you know, to, to have our kids see value in themselves and have our kids see value yeah. In, in their identity. Um, yeah,

Native Stories (05:57):

It’s so important to see ourselves and our ancestors, you know, even if you look at just one generation, maybe that’s not the best generation to look at, but if you look throughout history, the many that have come before us have fought, and you’ll always find someone to, you know, um, model after and wanna do better for your peers and for future generations. So yeah, just great points on, on what you’re doing and how it’s connected to that, but how you see yourself, you know, who you spoke about, right. Mm-hmm, <affirmative> your grandmother, your, and then just, you know, the people that you see, you, you hold responsibility within yourself because of the people that you feel connected to. So good points. Yeah. Um, so how did you get into math and what does that journey look like?

Craig Young (06:59):

Well, that to get there, that’s a good question. Um, I, I actually had a, a different experience, uh, with mathematics. So I always tease my, oh, I don’t tease, but, um, I always tell the students in, in a teasing way and older than the internet and, you know, like kinda like, what do you mean you’re older than the internet? How old are you? And you know, that that’s also a realization of how far and how fast technology has come and, and, uh, the what little surface we scratch and how much more we, we have, uh, to explore the technology. Um, so way back before the internet even existed. Uh

Native Stories (07:41):

<laugh> I feel like I’m just as old as you, so yeah, I preach <laugh>. Yeah. I was definitely a, a senior in high school when we had dial up and AOL dialup. Yeah.

Craig Young (07:57):

I think middle school, um, maybe <inaudible> or something, but, you know, I had great teachers, they were great. Um, but one thing that I’ve noticed, my teachers also struggled with was teaching mathematics. Um, so in a way, you know, they did their best, but I felt like they, well, most of them, you know, they, they struggle with, uh, explaining mathematics, uh, to us and I kind of fell behind. Um, I didn’t have that great experience with math. I, I, I actually didn’t like math. Uh, I disliked it. I thought it was too hard. Um, but I got discouraged and, um, you know, way, way back then there was no internet, no, nothing like that. It’s really hard to learn. Uh, if you weren’t paying attention in class or if you were absent or you just didn’t understand, uh, maybe the teacher was mean, I didn’t want to explain it.

Craig Young (08:57):

Uh, right. Um, so there’s a lot of variables involved. Um, but I didn’t, I didn’t get it. I struggled through school. I struggled all the way through high school, barely, um, you know, pass, uh, mathematics with high school. And, and then I went to college when I went to college, I actually started with remedial education, uh, with mathematics, like everything I should have learned from, uh, elementary school, middle school, high school, everything I should have learned, I should have been at that college algebra level. And it was a struggle. Um, so actually dropped outta high. Oh, I’m sorry. I dropped outta college my first year. Uh, I, you know, I just, I, I scraped by, you know, with like a C average and, and I, I thought, you know, math, math, wasn’t, I’m not a math person. I thought that, uh, college wasn’t for me.

Craig Young (09:50):

So I left after a year, I came home, uh, back to the, to, uh, KTA, uh, um, KTA, Arizona was where I grew up. Um, and, uh, I came back home and one summer I went over to, we have this place called, uh, uh, workforce development office. So I went there and they had this opportunity where they sent, uh, Navajo, uh, uh, anybody who was really interested that they, they sent us to Chicago, Illinois. Um, so we went to this iron working school, uh, I forget what it was called, national iron working school for native Americans, I believe. And that was in Broadview, Broadview, Illinois. And I stayed there for a bit, um, that that was a, a trade school basically. So, um, I learned how to become an ironworker. I learned about structural working or ornamental, iron working, reinforcing iron working. And I, I graduated, I got my certificate and I, there was a, a big, uh, reality check for me because I saw that, um, in, in the trade field, uh, I guess, no matter what you do in the trade field, if you wanna be electrician, if you wanna be a plumber worker, um, uh, alignment, you know, uh, just to name a few, everything is mathematical and blueprint blueprints.

Craig Young (11:18):

You know, you have to know what you’re doing on that job. Yeah. And safety is also a big thing. And so I stayed in Chicago for a, a number of years with local union one, and then I came home to Arizona. So I transferred unions and I, I joined local five here in Phoenix, um, in, in, uh, you know, all the older guys, they were telling me, go back to school, go back to school. And they were showing me like, you know, their, their, their hands and their hands, they were losing cartilage in it. And they were having a number of health problems, things that they breathe in when we were working up there and the sky with the skeleton of, uh, skyscrapers. And, and it was like, you know what, you’re, you’re probably right. I probably need to go back to college, but, you know, I was still intimidated, um, with, with mathematics.

Craig Young (12:08):

And so I got the hang of math, you know, just learning to trade, but, um, and then I ended up joining the Marine Corps. Um, so I really didn’t listen, you know, I just kind of like, you know, what, I wanna do something that wanted, that I want to challenge me. I wanted a, a challenge where, you know, something that I can prove to myself that I can do it. So I joined the Marine Corps and even in the military, everything is mathematical like the precision that you need to be, uh, so accurate with, with what you’re doing. Um, uh, when you’re, when you’re out there, when you’re, I guess, with all the, the pounds and weight carrying, um, uh, you know, just to name a few things, uh, everything was mathematical. And so a part of that, that journey, you know, I was thinking like, man, everything really revolves around this foundational skill, uh, problem solving, analytical thinking.

Craig Young (13:05):

And so I went back home after I got out of the military is like, what do I do next? You know, there’s life after the military. So for those of you guys who thinking, you know, don’t let the military use you, but use the military for, for, you know, all those great benefits, no matter what job you, you do, you’re gonna get the same benefits. Um, but I thought to myself, what do I do next? And one really unique thing, um, that I’ve I’ve realized was I could have went back to that same college that I originally started at, or I could have went to a big university, probably wouldn’t have been successful. Um, but one thing that stuck out to me was this college, our, our local tribal college university called the net college. And what was really interesting was that their core curriculum and values and everything revolved around the Navajo culture with the, uh, philosophy of, um, and this is, uh, that philosophy is grounded in Navajo culture and traditions.

Craig Young (14:08):

Uh, it speaks to organizational change while living in harmony with a natural world. And, and so that’s what it really drew me to that college. I learned more about who I was and my identity as a, not only as an indigenous person, but as a Navajo young man. And so I never thought I would become a, a teacher or an educator at all. That was the last thing on my mind. Um, but I’d always say that, uh, teaching found me and there was this, uh, individual there named, uh, Henry Fowler. He, he, he was, he’s a, uh, a Navajo mathematician and a professor at the net college that inspired me to, to, to become an educator. But that was where my foundation was set, uh, learning about who I am and reconnecting to my culture. And so that was part of my journey that launched me into getting, uh, my master’s degree and now working on my doctorate degree.

Native Stories (15:11):

Wow. So you like math now? <laugh> um, <laugh> yeah,

Craig Young (15:17):

Actually, um, I took a lot of hard work, especially with, uh, starting where I was at, um, learning about adding fractions, multiplying fractions, and just like taking that time during, uh, my personal time, uh, outside of class hours to, to catch up. And it took a lot of work and, but, you know, once it, things started to click in, in, you know, like things that things started to click and started to make sense. And that’s when I, I started to like math more and more and more and more. And now I’m, mm-hmm <affirmative> so it, it, it can be learned. It takes a lot of hard work, no matter what you do, there’s no practice hard work in practice.

Native Stories (16:04):

<laugh> lots of practice mm-hmm <affirmative> and I think confidence is the first thing that you have to overcome, right? Oh yeah. In order to, you’re gonna get it wrong. Yep. But the good thing about math is it’s black and white. It’s like it’s right or wrong. Mm-hmm <affirmative> whereas I feel like my, I had the same, I was always good at math. Um, I think my family just does numbers just for fun in, you know, con regular conversations, but, um, I hated history and now I love history <laugh> this is why I had this podcast. Uh, and native stories is cuz I was got so interested in so kind of opposite story, but, um, but you, I remember just having like taking a whole day or, or three days to do like one theory, math problem, you know, you gotta, you gotta keep trying, <laugh> get it right. But once you get it, it’s like, yay. Um, it’s worth it.

Craig Young (17:05):

Bring up a good there’re we’re gonna struggle a lot process.

Native Stories (17:16):

Yeah.

Craig Young (17:17):

Making mistakes, anything. And uh, you, once you develop that confidence, you stick with it, you persevere

Native Stories (17:24):

Persevere.

Craig Young (17:26):

Exactly. And you know, you’ll, you’ll get it eventually.

Native Stories (17:29):

So, and anything you do in life, you learn a lot through from math that you can get through it. Definitely. Um, so let’s skip to the next, uh, question, which is regarding teaching. Um, and, and I’m not sure. Can you first, uh, explain what ethno mathematics is? And then can you provide an example of what that is?

Craig Young (17:57):

Sure. Uh, well, ethno mathematics, that’s where we, we there, I guess you could say that, um, you could think of it like a, a paradigm shift of integrating, um, Navajo culture or even any indigenous culture and traditions into the Western math education and curriculum. And so we’re blending those two together. And what we wanna do is we wanna engage, uh, young indigenous students to, to build a strong cultural self identity. Um, but also connect them with our elders who are, who are the, uh, language holders, who are the, who are the ones that hold all the knowledge that, that knowledge we could say, knowledge holders. And there seems to be a lack of community, our elders and their native. We can that gap. I think that would be, uh, very, very good for, for people. Um, but ultimately mathematics, um, I guess culture tradition with mathematics.

Native Stories (19:11):

Can you provide an example of how you would do that for your students and how you do it now?

Craig Young (19:17):

Um, so, uh, you know, with, with the current curriculum that we have, it’s like a, a one size fits all approach with, with everybody, um, Caucasian students, African American students, Asian students, um, native American, all the way across the curriculum and all the way across, uh, I guess you could say the world. And so you could look at it as a one size fits all approach, but here’s the thing. Uh, everything is driven by data. Everything is driven statistics. Um, however, we’re at a disadvantage because we don’t really connect to what we’re reading in those, in those books. There’s not really a lot of, um, books out there that, um, focus on our, our, our culture, um, or indigenous cultures. And so there’s a disconnection there too, uh, where our kids don’t see themselves in mathematics, they don’t see themselves, uh, being valued as I mentioned before.

Craig Young (20:22):

And so, um, I honestly, you could say I kind of go rogue. I don’t really follow the curriculum, but I’ll, I’ll look at the example problems, but I’ll give it my own twist. Um, so I’ll, uh, this is where I’ll explain, um, for example, fractions, uh, decimals and percents. A lot of times our students see them as separate, uh, entities. They think that are separate from percent and that’s separate from, uh, decimals, but the way I would approach it is I would relate it to like what I mentioned earlier, we call it or, uh, kinship when I introduce my clan, uh, Chi Craig young, like this is who I am, my name’s Craig young. <inaudible>, that’s my mother’s clan. Cheneys Ching that’s my father’s clan. Uh, okay. So, um, Ash Chi, right? That gosh, Chi that’s my paternal grandfather’s clan my third clan and then not, well didn Ney.

Craig Young (21:30):

That’s my, my cha, uh, that’s my, uh, my, my last clan, right. Ash is my, um, Ash. I’m sorry. I’m, I’m kind of like, um, there, but Ash is my Cha’s clan and not to go, KA is my paternal grandpa’s clan, but I have those four clans where everybody in, in, in my, um, my kinship is represented. And so just like fraction, decimals, and percents, they’re all the same. They’re I, I, I, how I would explain it is that they’re siblings, fractions, decimals, and percents are sort of, um, they come from the same parents, you know, multiplication, multiplication begins with the letter M so we could say that’s the mom division <laugh>, um, division is also starts with the letter D that’s the dad. So when you think about it, multiplication and division, their inverse operations, um, they can undo each other. They can, uh, compliment each other.

Craig Young (22:35):

Right? So those, those are the parents of fractions, decimals and percent when we convert between them. That’s cool. And if, yeah, if you think about it, um, if you think about it, we could say that let’s say, for example, let’s say 90%, we could represent that same value, 90% as a decimal, as nine tens. And we can <crosstalk> that same, uh, fraction end. I’m sorry. We can represent that same percent end decimal as a fraction with 90, over a hundred. Okay. So we’re representing that same value in three unique ways. Like those siblings they’re, they’re all related, but maybe they’re different. Maybe one likes country, one likes, uh, maybe gangster rap, the other one, like <laugh>, you know, they, they’re all unique. They have their own personalities, their own likes dislikes, but no matter what, they’re siblings, they’re related, mom and dad, multiplication and division.

Craig Young (23:36):

And so if you think further, you can think of it as, uh, you know, addition, for example, addition or multiplication, just repeated addition. Right. Um, and if you think about division, that’s really just repeated subtraction. So if you integrate those four operators, multiplication, division, addition, subtraction, that would be their, their, their clans. Okay. Mm. Yeah. So relating that to, to my Navajo students, with their friendship system, let’s pretend that, um, percents, fractions of decimals let’s pretend that they were actual people and they would introduce themselves with their, so that would say multiplication. And then, because that’s mom’s plan multiplication mom’s plan, right. Multiplication <inaudible> then they would say, division bus team division would be their dad. And then, um, they would say addition that should cha Chay is actually, uh, the maternal grandfather. And then they would say subtraction dash. So,

Native Stories (24:50):

So you’re doing genealogy.

Craig Young (24:52):

Yeah. And

Native Stories (24:53):

So <laugh>,

Craig Young (24:55):

Once they

Native Stories (24:55):

See that by going up levels.

Craig Young (24:57):

Oh yeah. And they see that they’re like, oh, okay. That makes sense. Because you know, that, that’s how I would introduce myself with Mylans. And so once they see that, uh, they’re all related, they’re not separate things. And then things will just start to click and, you know, they, they use, for example, mom, and dad’s help to help them convert between fractions. They have the, and percent mm-hmm <affirmative>. And the funny thing too, is like, let’s say for example, um, they’re using division to help them convert between those, those three, but guess who helps out, uh, dad who always checks out dad’s work to make sure that it’s right. Mom,

Native Stories (25:35):

Mom, <laugh> parents are learning. Yeah.

Craig Young (25:48):

That would be one way.

Native Stories (25:49):

Huh? That’s super cool. I never thought about it that way, but that’s really, really cool. Um, thank you. Um, so, um, reading off your resume of projects, are there any project you’re working on now that we should be in the loop about? And, um, maybe in the future too, that you wanna shout out if there’s any fundraising opportunities or good opportunities to shout those out too right now?

Craig Young (26:22):

Yeah. Yeah. Actually my I’m working on a, a dissertation research right now. Um, and the title of my dissertation research is called, um, math, uh, math learning experience and traditional Navajo culture using math circles and Navajo culture to improve sixth grade students’ attitudes towards learning math and improve attitudes, uh, toward the value of traditional cultural wisdom. So not only are we, um, coping

Craig Young (26:53):

Change our attitudes towards math and, and, and, um, collapse that I guess you could say, um, I’m Henry Fowler coined this term collapsing, the fear of mathematics, not only are we doing that, but we’re also improving their attitudes toward learning about their language and culture as well. So we’re doing things at time. Um, so we’re doing that. And, uh, along with that, we do have a robotics team that I feel that is also very important with stem education and what we need is a, a, a greater representation of indigenous people’s and careers. There’s not many people in stem careers that are indigenous and, um, you know, guys out there. Um, what we wanna do is, uh, we want to inspire, we wanna inspire the next generation and, uh, to help, uh, you know, your, your, uh, language to help your, your people and come back and beat that change agent for, for, for your, uh, for wherever you come from. And so we wanna preserve our language. We wanna preserve our culture, our heritage, and, uh, hold onto our, our traditions in a way of life and, uh, taking that, uh, traditional holistic approach to, to compliment your life and, and way of thinking. Um, I feel that all, uh, indigenous communities have a history of complex mathematics and sciences throughout culture. Um, and honestly we are mathematics. Our, our language is full of mathematics. Our cultures are so rich with mathematics, um, every culture where

Native Stories (28:41):

Before there was engineering <laugh> we were already sustaining ourselves without polluting the earth. Like, how did that happen? Right. That, that was science mm-hmm <affirmative>, that was data collecting over years and, and implementation into the best fit, into, you know, sustaining our bodies and our minds. Um, yeah. So looking to your history <laugh>

Craig Young (29:08):

Yeah. And the thing with the, you know, the indigenous approach was, uh, we were living in harmony with, with natured and natural universe. Everything was, was, uh, everything was working well together until the influence of colonization. Yeah.

Native Stories (29:26):

We were better off <laugh>, but now we have this challenge, right. And using math and the Western way of, uh, doing things. Uh, but with the background of, for instance, being Navajo, uh, you can make some serious, uh, change in a positive, positive way.

Craig Young (29:58):

Definitely.

Native Stories (29:58):

I see indigenous people as the, the answer to climate change, to the answer, to cuz they’re the ones that care, um, and have the history on and on the engineering part. Um, and the math part. So, you know, it’s one of those, like why fix something that was broken now we have to reinvent something that has been broken, um, but still use our way of living as the foundation.

Craig Young (30:34):

Exactly.

Native Stories (30:36):

So you kids out there, you’re the next generation

Craig Young (30:42):

<laugh> yep. And you know, the last thing I wanna, you know, say to them too, is, uh, your listeners is that, you know, mathematics, it, it is a great teacher, uh, in life, for example, you know, we can’t run from our problems. Math teaches us to, to face those problems, face them, deal with them, head on, find a solution, solve it and then solve the next one and the next and the next, you know, that’s life there. So math, uh, is it’s always a great teacher in that sense where, you know, it teaches you guys, uh, deeper thinking skills to, to overcome any challenges that you have in life. And remember that you are that warrior, you come from a long lineage of warriors, it’s in your blood. And when, if we go back further, you know, when you were, when you were a baby, your parents held you in their arms, they saw you looking back at them, you know, that’s what they saw. They saw hope you are that hope. And I wanna leave that with you guys. And, uh, now do well, you know, if you’re struggling, you know, just stick with it, persevere, overcome, and, uh, preserve your language, your culture, your heritage, and, and we need you guys in those stem careers. We need more of a representation. We need more of your warriors out there to, to, to help, um, to help the world really.

Native Stories (32:10):

So thank, yeah. Mm-hmm <affirmative> thank you, Craig. That was a beautiful closing out <laugh> of this interview. Um, I just wanna say Mahalo for joining us. And, uh, we were, I thought we were gonna talk about math, but <laugh> instead, uh, Craig is such a great example for, uh, you know, future generation, anybody struggling with math. There’s definitely, always hope. So. Um, that being said, anything else, Craig, you would like, like to add?

Craig Young (32:43):

Um, you know, that’s all I really have right now, but um, you know, I do, I do have other projects that we have going on and if you, uh, if you can find us on, uh, Facebook, uh, I do have, uh, a mass circle program that are run called Arrowhead math circle. Um, if you go to, if you Google, um, the Alliance of indigenous mass circles come join us. We, we have mass circles every other Monday from five to 6:00 PM, um, mountain time. And we actually, uh, we have, um, collegiate mathematicians who, who work with our indigenous youth and it’s open to your grandparents. It’s open to your parents, you, your friends, um, really anybody who’s interested, but we’re called the, the Alliance of indigenous math circles. You can,

Native Stories (33:35):

We’ll get those links to, um, our listeners. So yeah, go ahead and said that to me, Craig, thank you so much.

Craig Young (33:43):

And it it’s free, you know, you don’t pay anything. It just, you show up. And the last thing I’ll say is, uh, what books are reading play is with, so just fun play with the numbers.

Native Stories (33:59):

Awesome. <laugh> uh, okay. So mahalo everybody for listening. Check us out on, uh, our website, nativestories.org, Facebook or Instagram, our native stories download the, um, mobile app where we have all the previous podcasts and walking tours. Um, if you have any suggestions for stories, go ahead and, uh, Instagram or our website is the best way to contact us. Everybody take care.